LOVE IT or HATE IT? JEEP's New Slogan - “Zero Emission Freedom”

And your understanding on the energy in AZ is true to a point, it really doesn’t explain the brown could over phx. Coal and Nat Gas is not primarily generated in the valley. SO our energy sector does not contribute to our air quality in valley.
That is not true at all. About half of the gas power plants in your whole state are in Maricopa County and with a number of them being right in the Phoenix area.
 
What cracks me up is how the catalytic converter supposedly was the grand fix for emissions since the 1970s. So much so that the government gets to fuck us in the ass every year or two to make sure our tailpipe isn't toxic but suddenly now 40ish years later, that isn't good enough now. Wake the fuck up, people.
 
What cracks me up is how the catalytic converter supposedly was the grand fix for emissions since the 1970s. So much so that the government gets to fuck us in the ass every year or two to make sure our tailpipe isn't toxic but suddenly now 40ish years later, that isn't good enough now. Wake the fuck up, people.
LOL - exactly!

And really, that's my whole problem with all this electric crap. I just don't feel like we're allowed to have an honest discussion about it. None of it makes sense and if you question or worse, disagree with the products of propaganda, you're some kind of science denier who is hell bent on making people breath dirty air, drink dirty water and destroy the planet.

Again, I really like the idea of electric especially when it comes to power and performance. I want to be excited about it - not forced to accept it.
 
LOL - exactly!

And really, that's my whole problem with all this electric crap. I just don't feel like we're allowed to have an honest discussion about it. None of it makes sense and if you question or worse, disagree with the products of propaganda, you're some kind of science denier who is hell bent on making people breath dirty air, drink dirty water and destroy the planet.

Again, I really like the idea of electric especially when it comes to power and performance. I want to be excited about it - not forced to accept it.
Exactly. I'm all about embracing the modern advances, but that's not what this is about.
 
Exactly. I'm all about embracing the modern advances, but that's not what this is about.
Not even close. And really, I just don't get it. We were able to harness the power of the atom, send men to the moon but somehow, the best we can do in 2021 is make a Wrangler with a 20 mile battery range and we're told to love it because it'll help save the planet. :rolleyes:
 
Not even close. And really, I just don't get it. We were able to harness the power of the atom, send men to the moon but somehow, the best we can do in 2021 is make a Wrangler with a 20 mile battery range and we're told to love it because it'll help save the planet. :rolleyes:
Exactly. What the fuck has happened to this "America?"
 
Exactly. What the fuck has happened to this "America?"
Oh man, don't even get me started.

What I will say, is that there was once a time when America took on any and every problem head on. There was nothing we couldn't solve especially through science and technology. Today, the only answer we're allowed to entertain regarding problems such as pollution, is abstinence.
 
Amen on the power of the American Free Market. 🇺🇸🇺🇸🇺🇸 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

Government mandating shit is not the solution. 👎🏻💩

Some simple research on how much additional electricity will be needed in order to power all the new EV cars illustrates how this transition away from ICE vehicles is NOT realistic.

Additionally the demand for ‘Rare Earth’ minerals required to manufacture the batteries need to convert all the worlds existing vehicles to EV exceeds the world’s known reserves of these materials.

The bottom line is if this BS is carried out most individuals will NOT be able to own an automobile due to the incredible high price, instead most people will be forced to rely on government mass transportation. Don’t worry though, the government is here to take care of you. The government is full of super smart people who have it all figured out and they never make any mistakes. 😂🤣
 
if the government is all about green energy why not target there own fleet (military vehicles) to some sort of green energy instead of vehicles that get 2mpg?
 
The bottom line is if this BS is carried out most individuals will NOT be able to own an automobile due to the incredible high price, instead most people will be forced to rely on government mass transportation. Don’t worry though, the government is here to take care of you. The government is full of super smart people who have it all figured out and they never make any mistakes. 😂🤣
It's hard not to think, that IS the plan.
 
Because the emissions produced in the manufacturing of said EV’s and the production of electricity to “fuel” them far exceeds the amount produced by fossil fueled vehicles. The electricity has to come from somewhere and it is not green or free of emissions.

You are correct, we should be incentivizing clean (hopefully nuclear power) to support the grid. And manufacturing of anything will produce a byproduct, so the argument is neutral there.
 
Umm, my point exactly? That a LOT of the crap you see in the air is in fact from construction dust and not just car emissions. :unsure:

Wow... I mean, just wow. You really don't get it.

I really had no idea this would be so hard for you to understand but please, try to follow me for just a second here. A majority of electric power plants in Arizona are run on coal and gas and with about half of gas ones being in Maricopa county - you know, where Phoenix is. Burning gas produces air pollution. If all cars ran on electricity, MORE electricity would need to be produced and that would mean even more gas would need to be burned. Even if it's a Duracell, you can't just take a pair of AA batteries and use them to light up your whole house, turn on your TV, run your computer and charge up your phone.


Coal power is not made any where near Maricopa county and if you know about natural gas plants, they are not base load power - meaning they only ramp up for demand power, typically in the afternoon of summer months when energy is critical for cool air in houses. Most of the time, outside of peak demand summer, they sit without operating. When I hike the mountains at 7am the brown cloud is from commuter traffic, disputing this is ignorance. Oh and AZ biggest energy provider is moving to 100% clean energy, so NG/Coal won’t be an issue soon.

I didn’t think this would be that hard for you to comprehend either, but here we are discussing such things.

I guess I leave with this, if you believe that NG is polluting the air, then you agree ICE are too. So less ICE cars/trucks means better air quality - just like less NG plants? Right?

I understand you live in a rural area, how would you feel if I dropped 4-5 million commuters there between the house of 6-9am and 4-6pm? I’m sure you’d love that.

If we remove all ICE cars/trucks from the roads then the air quality will be better, so reducing some will help - common sense says so? Why is this so hard to grasp or complain about? We could do this all day, but I think my logic is clear and fair.
 
Coal power is not made any where near Maricopa county
Ummm, I realize that reading isn't a strong point of yours but for the record, I NEVER said they were.
and if you know about natural gas plants, they are not base load power - meaning they only ramp up for demand power, typically in the afternoon of summer months when energy is critical for cool air in houses. Most of the time, outside of peak demand summer, they sit without operating.
LOL - because Phoenix is only hot in June, July and August. But hey, you're the expert here.
When I hike the mountains at 7am the brown cloud is from commuter traffic, disputing this is ignorance.
LOL - says the guy who said if "you’ve never done construction in Maricopa - Dust will shut a job site down".
Oh and AZ biggest energy provider is moving to 100% clean energy, so NG/Coal won’t be an issue soon.
You mean like every state in the union has been moving toward for over a decade now. Yeah, it'll be any day now LOL
I didn’t think this would be that hard for you to comprehend either, but here we are discussing such things.
Awe, guess I struck a nerve with that one. Sorry about that LOL
I guess I leave with this, if you believe that NG is polluting the air, then you agree ICE are too.
Uh, DUH! That was my point boy genius.
So less ICE cars/trucks means better air quality - just like less NG plants? Right?
Not sure how you have less gas plants when all cars need to be running on electricity but hey, you're the guy who knows all about things like what the EPA has in store for us in spite of NOT reading a damn thing.
I understand you live in a rural area, how would you feel if I dropped 4-5 million commuters there between the house of 6-9am and 4-6pm? I’m sure you’d love that.
LOL - Yup, I sure do and never wouldn't have a clue what it would be like to live in an area with almost 10 million people and for longer than you've been alive.
If we remove all ICE cars/trucks from the roads then the air quality will be better, so reducing some will help - common sense says so?
Only IF electric production was made by more than 14% from renewable sources. Sucks that isn't the case now nor will it be in the next 5 years.
Why is this so hard to grasp or complain about? We could do this all day, but I think my logic is clear and fair.
Why all this is so hard for you to grasp is clear as day to me. Just like all the products of propaganda, you have to be right and I have to be wrong. And that's cool. You win, batteries are just a harmless waste product of energy, there are no gas power plants in Phoenix or there are but only turn on during June, July and August, construction dust can shut a job site down but isn't a contributor to the brown cloud and driving Jeeps that have a 20 mile battery range will end air pollution as we know. Got it. ✌️
 
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Weirdly negative response from folks. We’re talking about a decade from now, for starters, and a 40% US target. Nobody said anything about taking away your toys.

EVs at maturity will be nothing short of awesome for 90% of the off-road crew. Wildly better low end torque. Quiet on a trail. Fewer parts to bust. Rationally this group should be some of the most excited, if it weren’t for the politics of EVs . Yes, today the weight is too high and the cost isn’t quite where it needs to be. But fast forward a decade or two and I think anybody with a Hemi is going to realize they’re far from the top dog on the trails. Plus imagine having 40s without having to regear, and what if you could pay the equivalent of $1/gallon for gas around town? Jeepers get defensive about smiles per gallon; I don’t know about you, but if I could save a few grand a year in gas that pays for a lot of mods.
You must’ve voted for Biden and probably wear a mask while jeeping
 
What cracks me up is how the catalytic converter supposedly was the grand fix for emissions since the 1970s. So much so that the government gets to fuck us in the ass every year or two to make sure our tailpipe isn't toxic but suddenly now 40ish years later, that isn't good enough now. Wake the fuck up, people.
Catalytic converters are so great people are stealing them...poor man’s Bitcoin...
 
All I can tell you is that the truth is out there. This is not Fox news or some other rightwing propaganda, this is directly from the California Energy Commission.
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https://www.energy.ca.gov/data-reports/california-power-generation-and-power-sources

And, for those of you in Arizona, this is from the EIA - U.S. Energy Information Administration and they give a more rosy number by saying "more than half" of the 14% of renewable energy produced is from solar.
View attachment 364936

Those are actual and factual numbers and the rest of the electricity has to come from somewhere. I'll be interested to see what these numbers look like in 4 years when most every new car made will need to be run off of electricity.
Do those "renewable" sources include hydroelectric power such as from Hoover dam on the Colorado River (now generating at 60% of normal capacity)?
 
Do those "renewable" sources include hydroelectric power such as from Hoover dam on the Colorado River (now generating at 60% of normal capacity)?
Yes, including hydroelectric, TOTAL renewable power production is only 14% in the state of Arizona.
 
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