Desperate for a 4x4 shop near Loyalton, CA (or Truckee or Reno)

Okay, so I had some time to get under the jeep this weekend and didn't find a single joint with any play. I had my son saw the steering wheel back and forth and didn't find any of the steering or suspension components moving at their connection points.

However I did feel a bit of crunch or cluck in the drag link. I could feel it when I grabbed the link while my son was moving the wheel with the engine on. The drag link joints did not seem to have any play in them, though. I checked the pitman arm and that also did not seem to be loose on the shaft (on the big end).
However, when I had him start the engine and saw the wheel, while looking down from the top of the engine bay, I could see the steering gear box moving side to side. Not a lot, but there is something flexing or the frame is cracked. I have a Rusty's frame side trackbar brace and the bolts that go through the frame are tight and don't move at all while he is sawing the wheel.

I also observed a small amount of play in what I believe is the driver's side unit bearing.

Third thing I found was zero weights on the front driver's side wheel. But there is some adhesive on it. But I'm not sure that was left overs from when I had the Milestars pulled off and put the new Falkens on.

I had a friend show up just as I found these three things and haven't been able to investigate further.

But I think I still have my stock track bar (not sure) but if I do I am going to put that in to see if anything changes. Before I do that though I am going to do a 4 tire rotation to see if that wheel with no weights is involved.
 
cosmokenney said:
Okay, so I had some time to get under the jeep this weekend and didn't find a single joint with any play. I had my son saw the steering wheel back and forth and didn't find any of the steering or suspension components moving at their connection points.

However I did feel a bit of crunch or cluck in the drag link. I could feel it when I grabbed the link while my son was moving the wheel with the engine on. The drag link joints did not seem to have any play in them, though. I checked the pitman arm and that also did not seem to be loose on the shaft (on the big end).
However, when I had him start the engine and saw the wheel, while looking down from the top of the engine bay, I could see the steering gear box moving side to side. Not a lot, but there is something flexing or the frame is cracked. I have a Rusty's frame side trackbar brace and the bolts that go through the frame are tight and don't move at all while he is sawing the wheel.

I also observed a small amount of play in what I believe is the driver's side unit bearing.

Third thing I found was zero weights on the front driver's side wheel. But there is some adhesive on it. But I'm not sure that was left overs from when I had the Milestars pulled off and put the new Falkens on.

I had a friend show up just as I found these three things and haven't been able to investigate further.

But I think I still have my stock track bar (not sure) but if I do I am going to put that in to see if anything changes. Before I do that though I am going to do a 4 tire rotation to see if that wheel with no weights is involved.
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1st thing I would do is get the tires rebalanced, I've had weights fall off; it happens.
It would be extremely lucky if you happened on a wheel/tire combo that were so perfectly round and balanced it required no weights.
 
Any of you guys have experience with the Barnes 4WD Heim joints or Enduro joints? They have a 7/8-14 enduro joint with 9/16" bolt hole that would be a direct replacement for the Rancho trackbar end. The enduro joint has polyurethane cups. And it only $40 so that would be a cheap way to eliminate the rancho track bar. And if that works out i might replace all the rancho joints. I really don't think the rancho tubing is the problem since it is 0.290 inch wall DOM. Preferably I want to go all all-metal heims if I can find them. Unfortunately Barnes doesn't have them with the correct bolt hole for the track bar.
 
AZVAJKU said:
I’d try this:
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Disciple is a 5 hour 30 minute drive from my house at freeway speeds. At this point I can't go over 45 MPH safely.
I know how to search google maps. But what I don't know is which one of the 3 or 4 4WD shops in Reno have a good or bad reputation. That's all I'm asking for is recommendations. There is a 4 wheel parts store in Reno, but have no idea if they can be trusted to do anything except throw parts at it.
 
cosmokenney said:
Disciple is a 5 hour 30 minute drive from my house at freeway speeds. At this point I can't go over 45 MPH safely.
I know how to search google maps. But what I don't know is which one of the 3 or 4 4WD shops in Reno have a good or bad reputation. That's all I'm asking for is recommendations. There is a 4 wheel parts store in Reno, but have no idea if they can be trusted to do anything except throw parts at it.
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If you have a way to tow it I’d go see Jeremy at disciple. 4wheel parts in AZ blows
 
cosmokenney said:
Okay, so I had some time to get under the jeep this weekend and didn't find a single joint with any play. I had my son saw the steering wheel back and forth and didn't find any of the steering or suspension components moving at their connection points.

However I did feel a bit of crunch or cluck in the drag link. I could feel it when I grabbed the link while my son was moving the wheel with the engine on. The drag link joints did not seem to have any play in them, though. I checked the pitman arm and that also did not seem to be loose on the shaft (on the big end).
However, when I had him start the engine and saw the wheel, while looking down from the top of the engine bay, I could see the steering gear box moving side to side. Not a lot, but there is something flexing or the frame is cracked. I have a Rusty's frame side trackbar brace and the bolts that go through the frame are tight and don't move at all while he is sawing the wheel.

I also observed a small amount of play in what I believe is the driver's side unit bearing.

Third thing I found was zero weights on the front driver's side wheel. But there is some adhesive on it. But I'm not sure that was left overs from when I had the Milestars pulled off and put the new Falkens on.

I had a friend show up just as I found these three things and haven't been able to investigate further.

But I think I still have my stock track bar (not sure) but if I do I am going to put that in to see if anything changes. Before I do that though I am going to do a 4 tire rotation to see if that wheel with no weights is involved.
Click to expand...
My checklist to find the issue would be
1. Have all tires rebalanced,, but then again I buy from Discount Tire and don't have to pay for these things no matter how many times they get rebalanced.
2. Check the torque on the steering box with a torque wrench. if it's moving something is allowing it to flex.
I always loosen the bolt to make sure something isn't cross threaded, add red thread locker and torque to spec.
3. If you felt track bar issues the only way to fully inspect this to remove it and see if the bushings are shot.
4. Steering stabilizer, I'd pull it off, check the bushings, put it back on and make sure it's moving in parallel with the tie rod full lock to lock. If there's any binding in the steering stabilizer it will cause anything from steering kick back to possible DW.
learned my lesson years ago, don't trust just a visual inspection and me shaking a parts to see if it's tight.
At the torque values these items should be at, they would have to loosen up quite a bit to be able to manually shake check it for looseness.
. Anything with a bushing I will always remove and check the bushing if I suspect there is an issue with that part.
 
jeeeep said:
My checklist to find the issue would be
1. Have all tires rebalanced,, but then again I buy from Discount Tire and don't have to pay for these things no matter how many times they get rebalanced.
2. Check the torque on the steering box with a torque wrench. if it's moving something is allowing it to flex.
I always loosen the bolt to make sure something isn't cross threaded, add red thread locker and torque to spec.
3. If you felt track bar issues the only way to fully inspect this to remove it and see if the bushings are shot.
4. Steering stabilizer, I'd pull it off, check the bushings, put it back on and make sure it's moving in parallel with the tie rod full lock to lock. If there's any binding in the steering stabilizer it will cause anything from steering kick back to possible DW.
learned my lesson years ago, don't trust just a visual inspection and me shaking a parts to see if it's tight.
At the torque values these items should be at, they would have to loosen up quite a bit to be able to manually shake check it for looseness.
. Anything with a bushing I will always remove and check the bushing if I suspect there is an issue with that part.
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Item #1 is next. #2 already done. When I installed the rusty's frame-side trackbar brace I torqued and red loc-tited. I also marked to bolts with a paint pen so I could see if they moved. While under there last weekend, I checked if they were tight and I couldn't move them. Also the JL frame is known to flex, it turns out. I also have to get back in there and see if the frame is cracked. RE #3, I didn't feel any movement in the trackbar joints. The only thing I could feel something odd on was the drag link/pitman arm/steering box as mentioned above. #4 I didn't think would be a problem since the ss is only 6 months old, but I'll try that today. As far as moving parallel, I have a metalcloak tie rod and their mounting brackets on both the axle and tie rod. So, the ss i at a slight downward angle from the axle to the tie rod. Both mounts are made with an angle in the mounting surface to prevent binding. But I'll check that again.

All other bolts and jam nuts on the suspension components are also marked with paint pens to make sure nothing moves.
 
So, after checking for play in all of the the suspension and steering components and finding none, I went ahead and loosened every end bolt. Then re-torqued each of them to spec. I then checked the toe with the angle aluminum clamped to the rotor method. It was toed in a lot more than I thought. So using 24" angle on both rotors, I set it to as close to between 1/32" - 1/16" as I could get it. That should get me pretty close to 0.15 degree of total toe in. That got rid of the violent death wobble at 50+ MPH. But I am still getting some steering feedback when hitting expansion cracks and pot holes while turning. Just 4 or 5 little wobbles that go away on their own. So I am going to get some 48" angle aluminum and reduce the toe a little more. The extra length on the angle will help with the measurements since at 48", 1/6" difference will be ~0.075 degrees total toe. A lot easier than dealing with 1/32 or 1/64 of an inch when using 24" angle.
I might also try a sector shaft brace because even with the frame side trackbar brace, I can still see the steering box pull away from the frame a little while moving the steering wheel. I'll probably go with the MetalCloack sector shaft brace so I don't have to replace the Rusty's track bar brace.

For calculating the angles I am using this page: https://robrobinette.com/ConvertToeInchesToDegrees.htm
 
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cosmokenney said:
So, after checking for play in all of the the suspension and steering components and finding none, I went ahead and loosened every end bolt. Then re-torqued each of them to spec. I then checked the toe with the angle aluminum clamped to the rotor method. It was toed in a lot more than I thought. So using 24" angle on both rotors, I set it to as close to between 1/32" - 1/16" as I could get it. That should get me pretty close to 0.15 degree of total toe in. That got rid of the violent death wobble at 50+ MPH. But I am still getting some steering feedback when hitting expansion cracks and pot holes while turning. Just 4 or 5 little wobbles that go away on their own. So I am going to get some 48" angle aluminum and reduce the toe a little more. The extra length on the angle will help with the measurements since at 48", 1/6" difference will be ~0.075 degrees total toe. A lot easier than dealing with 1/32 or 1/64 of an inch when using 24" angle.
I might also try a sector shaft brace because even with the frame side trackbar brace, I can still see the steering box pull away from the frame a little while moving the steering wheel. I'll probably go with the MetalCloack sector shaft brace so I don't have to replace the Rusty's track bar brace.

For calculating the angles I am using this page: https://robrobinette.com/ConvertToeInchesToDegrees.htm
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Does your lift include geometry correction brackets? If not, they could certainly make a positive difference when turning over potholes, which produce some vertical travel.
 
bobfriesenhahn said:
Does your lift include geometry correction brackets? If not, they could certainly make a positive difference when turning over potholes, which produce some vertical travel.
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I assume you are referring to the brackets that drop the LCAs on the frame side? I do not have those. I haven't decided what I am doing with the lift yet. But I might be doing a 3.5" MetaCloak Game Changer to replace the Rancho 2.5" full kit (came with decent adjustable LCA/UCA, Track Bars ...). The MC kit comes with drop brackets as far as I know (might be an option). Aside from shocks/springs the Rancho kit isn't bad overall but it barely netted any lift over the stock Rubicon. And the rear is drooping (kit was only installed 2 years ago) to the point that the rear rubs too easily. I have to decide if I just want to go with a new set of shocks and springs or an entire replacement. Either way I will probably look into drop brackets.
 
cosmokenney said:
I assume you are referring to the brackets that drop the LCAs on the frame side? I do not have those. I haven't decided what I am doing with the lift yet. But I might be doing a 3.5" MetaCloak Game Changer to replace the Rancho 2.5" full kit (came with decent adjustable LCA/UCA, Track Bars ...). The MC kit comes with drop brackets as far as I know (might be an option). Aside from shocks/springs the Rancho kit isn't bad overall but it barely netted any lift over the stock Rubicon. And the rear is drooping (kit was only installed 2 years ago) to the point that the rear rubs too easily. I have to decide if I just want to go with a new set of shocks and springs or an entire replacement. Either way I will probably look into drop brackets.
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The Metalcloak does not come with the drop bracket you have to get them separately. If the Rancho arms are adjustable and there’s nothing wrong with them why not just get taller springs and shocks? I have the Metalcloak Gamechanger and really like it but not sure what you’d be getting that the Rancho doesn’t have other than the garish gold. Since your in Cali I doubt you have to worry about salt on the roads like here in the East so the anodizing is not really an advantage for you.
 
NPC 6060⁸42 said:
The Metalcloak does not come with the drop bracket you have to get them separately. If the Rancho arms are adjustable and there’s nothing wrong with them why not just get taller springs and shocks? I have the Metalcloak Gamechanger and really like it but not sure what you’d be getting that the Rancho doesn’t have other than the garish gold. Since your in Cali I doubt you have to worry about salt on the roads like here in the East so the anodizing is not really an advantage for you.
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It is my (limited) understanding that the control arm drop brackets get the UCA and LCA more parallel to the ground which supposedly helps with bump steer/wobble and brake/acceleration dive.
 
cosmokenney said:
It is my (limited) understanding that the control arm drop brackets get the UCA and LCA more parallel to the ground which supposedly helps with bump steer/wobble and brake/
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Good info here

At what lift height do I need to consider a control arm drop bracket?

At what lift height do I need to consider a control arm drop bracket? Running a Skyjacker 2.5"/1" leveling lift (all springs and new shocks) I'm getting the occasional mild wobble at 50-55 mph. It's only hit scary level once and it's been on the truck a year now. It gets more prominent any...
www.wayalife.com www.wayalife.com
 
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