Sometimes you have to man up and be passive

Samuelh3

Caught the Bug
Went wheeling in the early evening with a buddy last weekend at Holy Jim. A small trail with mostly creek crawling and some hill climbs. He was taking one of his family members wheeling for the first time.

Long story short I was following him and he ended up getting us lost in the creek and ended up on some dudes property. The moment I realized we were on what seemed to be private property I called it in on the radio and stopped.

As you can imagine, the home owner which apparently was just around the corner outside of my view was very upset that we were there. And rightfully so. He approached my Jeep and I immediately apologized and let him know I was following the lead jeep and we got turned around. I asked him if he could help us get back on the trail and he angrily told us he’d lead us to his front gate.

At this point all was pretty good. He seemed justifiably upset but willing to help us get home and ultimately off his property....until we got to the front gate.

At this point things got a little sketchy. We were now wedged in between the gate on a narrow trail with room for about 1-2 jeeps wide and another car that showed up behind from the house. So basically we’re trapped. Our original entry point to his property was no longer accessible and now this dude is going off on us.

My situation awareness senses were going off like crazy. It was dark and I noticed someone walking in the trees about 100 yards behind us with a flashlight. We’re basically completely trapped with limited visibility and when I asked the guy if he’s gonna open the gate he told me to shut the fuck up and wait.

At this point I had two options, escalate to the level he was at or de-escalate and try to calm him down. Considering where we were and the fact that he was probably armed (I would be way out there) I decided to de-escalate. The man in me wanted to confront him for his dis-respect but the gun fighter in me knew better.

You see, they say an armed society is a polite society. I had my 9mm XD loaded with hollow points and one in the chamber, no safety. Given how often I train I could accurately put shots on multiple targets from the holster in less than 3 seconds. But I train not to fight but to protect. Had I not been armed I would have been in that guy’s face without a doubt. But situational awareness (remember the guy in the trees?) told me better. I calmly spoke to the man, let him call me all kinds of names and patiently waited long enough for him to calm down and open the gate which he did after a long 20 minutes.

This could have gone down very differently and I’m glad that it didn’t. I’m glad I was armed that day as it forced me to de-escalate vs meeting fire w/ fire (pun intended).

Given the recent events I thought I would share what a responsible gun owner looks like.


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People are crazy, I carry almost every day because of that. It’s a good point that carrying gives you the confidence to De-escalate a situation, most people don’t understand that. Glad you got out of there safe and sound.


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Damn, that’s intense! You make a good point. At the end of the day, it’s about making it back home safely. We don’t carry so that we look badass or go looking for trouble. We carry to protect ourselves and pray that we never need to do so. Way to keep your cool in a tight spot.
 
I have a question? And this is from a non gun owner and from a state that has a ton of regulations. How would that have gone over, considering you were on his property with a loaded weapon? Say it escalated and guns were drawn and the authorities show up. Who's in the right in that situation in your state?


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Yeah it was pretty intense. Funny part is my buddy probably had no idea what was really going on. There was a moment where I locked eyes with the home owner for an awkwardly long time. It was one of those “look buddy I’m not scared of you and your not scared of me so how ‘bout we don’t do this”

I forgot to mention to make matters worse his wife showed up as was all frantic. Yelling and screaming about us having Jeeps and knowing better (The home owner has a real nice built up jeep). The sad part was she was right. We should have turned around we we got lost. It really struck me and kept ringing in my head. Felt bad so I went back a few days later to their front gate (not on their prosperity!!)and dropped off a card with a apology note hoping to see them on the trail under better conditions. Needed to close the loop on that whole situation, especially since I have my wayalife banner on the jeep. I’d hate for the to get a bad opinion of us here on the forum because of a stupid mistake I made.


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I have a question? And this is from a non gun owner and from a state that has a ton of regulations. How would that have gone over, considering you were on his property with a loaded weapon? Say it escalated and guns were drawn and the authorities show up. Who's in the right in that situation in your state?


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If the op drew and got wasted, the homeowner would argue he was protecting himself from a dangerous armed trespasser and probably get off scott free.

If the OP drew and wasted the homeowner, he’d probably be convicted of man slaughter because he was a trespasser and used deadly force without justification.

This, of course, unless you are in Texas or Florida. Then anyone can blast away without legal consequences. [emoji23]
 
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Glad everything worked itself out for you. Those wannabe 2wd offroaders ruins it for me there.
 
If the op drew and got wasted, the homeowner would argue he was protecting himself from a dangerous armed trespasser and probably get off scott free.

If the OP drew and wasted the homeowner, he’d probably be convicted of man slaughter because he was a trespasser and used deadly force without justification.

This, of course, unless you are in Texas or Florida. Then anyone can blast away without legal consequences. [emoji23]

Not true. I’ve got a buddy who’s an OC Sheriff. I called him as I was concerned ‘cause they took photos of me and my jeep and wanted to know what fines if any I was going to have to pay. First off you have to have a Posted No trespassing sign every 20 feet, there was none. Second you need to have intent to trespass, it was obvious we were lost. Third, technically we were being held against our will which is kidnapping. He actually asked me if I wanted to press charges. He basically confirmed we didn’t do anything illegal but what the homeowner did was highly illegal.

That being said we had several witnesses to the fact we were lost and being held against our will. It would have been a justifiable self defense on my part from a legal standpoint had the owner drawn his weapon or shown any signs of wanting to commit bodily harm. From a moral standpoint it would have been a disaster. That’s not something you recover from emotionally. Life is precious...all life.


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Not true. I’ve got a buddy who’s an OC Sheriff. I called him as I was concerned ‘cause they took photos of me and my jeep and wanted to know what fines if any I was going to have to pay. First off you have to have a Posted No trespassing sign every 20 feet, there was none. Second you need to have intent to trespass, it was obvious we were lost. Third, technically we were being held against our will which is kidnapping. He actually asked me if I wanted to press charges. He basically confirmed we didn’t do anything illegal but what the homeowner did was highly illegal.

That being said we had several witnesses to the fact we were lost and being held against our will. It would have been a justifiable self defense on my part from a legal standpoint had the owner drawn his weapon or shown any signs of wanting to commit bodily harm. From a moral standpoint it would have been a disaster. That’s not something you recover from emotionally. Life is precious...all life.


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Well, (1) I was joking, (2) your buddy is a cop not a district attorney, and (3) I’m glad you got through it without anyone escalating.
 
Well, (1) I was joking, (2) your buddy is a cop not a district attorney, and (3) I’m glad you got through it without anyone escalating.

This is not a joking matter! I’m offended. Gonna go into my safe space (aka jeep) with my crayons and coloring books until you respond the way I think you should but I’m not going to tell you what that looks like so I can just keep being offended. [emoji23]


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Not true. I’ve got a buddy who’s an OC Sheriff. I called him as I was concerned ‘cause they took photos of me and my jeep and wanted to know what fines if any I was going to have to pay. First off you have to have a Posted No trespassing sign every 20 feet, there was none. Second you need to have intent to trespass, it was obvious we were lost. Third, technically we were being held against our will which is kidnapping. He actually asked me if I wanted to press charges. He basically confirmed we didn’t do anything illegal but what the homeowner did was highly illegal.

That being said we had several witnesses to the fact we were lost and being held against our will. It would have been a justifiable self defense on my part from a legal standpoint had the owner drawn his weapon or shown any signs of wanting to commit bodily harm. From a moral standpoint it would have been a disaster. That’s not something you recover from emotionally. Life is precious...all life.


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This really tells me my impression of you was correct. I've had a small bit of training myself and from your story you did exactly the right thing.
Even being justified self defense so many bad things could have come of a conflict like that.

Really glad it worked out.
 
This is not a joking matter! I’m offended. Gonna go into my safe space (aka jeep) with my crayons and coloring books until you respond the way I think you should but I’m not going to tell you what that looks like so I can just keep being offended. [emoji23]


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My safe space has beer. [emoji482]
 
I've heard the residents there are not very fond of the off-roading traffic.... sounds like he was in defense mode because of the tresspassing... But probably a little hot headed since he tried to trap you... especially after offering to lead you out, blocking you in was uncalled for. And being that I have met you, and you seem like a solid dude, I'm sure you were apologetic & polite. Well played for sure. Glad it worked out.
 
I do not carry but hubby does always, this event shows a responsible gun owner's actions, well done! To carry for protection of self or others is the original purpose of concealed carry. I appreciate that the owner is upset and could have been fed up but in no way shape or form did he have right to commit "unlawful restraint" and prevent OP from leaving. In Florida we have the castle doctrine where you can protect your home, would it be protecting YOUR home when you are physically preventing and intimidating with a weapon? There is also the stand your ground doctrine where if OP is threatened by the land owner he had the right to protect self. That would be a hard sell to a jury.
The land owner created a prefect storm that could have produced catastrophic results. The old adage live to fight another day comes to mind. De-escalate was the real man's answer. Imho.

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Went wheeling in the early evening with a buddy last weekend at Holy Jim. A small trail with mostly creek crawling and some hill climbs. He was taking one of his family members wheeling for the first time.

Long story short I was following him and he ended up getting us lost in the creek and ended up on some dudes property. The moment I realized we were on what seemed to be private property I called it in on the radio and stopped.

As you can imagine, the home owner which apparently was just around the corner outside of my view was very upset that we were there. And rightfully so. He approached my Jeep and I immediately apologized and let him know I was following the lead jeep and we got turned around. I asked him if he could help us get back on the trail and he angrily told us he’d lead us to his front gate.

At this point all was pretty good. He seemed justifiably upset but willing to help us get home and ultimately off his property....until we got to the front gate.

At this point things got a little sketchy. We were now wedged in between the gate on a narrow trail with room for about 1-2 jeeps wide and another car that showed up behind from the house. So basically we’re trapped. Our original entry point to his property was no longer accessible and now this dude is going off on us.

My situation awareness senses were going off like crazy. It was dark and I noticed someone walking in the trees about 100 yards behind us with a flashlight. We’re basically completely trapped with limited visibility and when I asked the guy if he’s gonna open the gate he told me to shut the fuck up and wait.

At this point I had two options, escalate to the level he was at or de-escalate and try to calm him down. Considering where we were and the fact that he was probably armed (I would be way out there) I decided to de-escalate. The man in me wanted to confront him for his dis-respect but the gun fighter in me knew better.

You see, they say an armed society is a polite society. I had my 9mm XD loaded with hollow points and one in the chamber, no safety. Given how often I train I could accurately put shots on multiple targets from the holster in less than 3 seconds. But I train not to fight but to protect. Had I not been armed I would have been in that guy’s face without a doubt. But situational awareness (remember the guy in the trees?) told me better. I calmly spoke to the man, let him call me all kinds of names and patiently waited long enough for him to calm down and open the gate which he did after a long 20 minutes.

This could have gone down very differently and I’m glad that it didn’t. I’m glad I was armed that day as it forced me to de-escalate vs meeting fire w/ fire (pun intended).

Given the recent events I thought I would share what a responsible gun owner looks like.


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Just read this and it peaked my interest so I thought I’d throw a wrench in the mix here. Don’t get me wrong, you handled that better than most people ever could have dreamed of for sure given the situation that guy put you in ( which is to say the least fucked) but why does an armed society have to be a polite one? I totally understand what you’re saying here having been on both sides of that type of situation before but that’s more a mindset thing isn’t it? Since I’ve been in martial arts from when I was 5 till now (22) I’ve always been taught self control and trained to react instead of act. (For example if you punch me, I react/ counter your punch. Never throw a first punch type thing.) Having been in situations unarmed and been out numbered, out sized, places I didn’t know my way around on vacations even having weapons in my face, I can say I never needed a gun to remain calm or situationally aware. Whether it be open or concealed, What/why should carrying change a mindset of controlling ones emotions regarding a situation and possible lives being in danger should something escalate?

I’m not trying to start any drama or fights or anything like that, it’s just rare that I can have an adult conversation about such touchy topics with people who are mature.

For the record, I’m a proud gun owner myself and carry my Judge loaded with 2 410s and 3 .45 hollow points from time to time depending where I’m going
Same team[emoji847][emoji16]


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Hmm, got to wonder how many times people "got lost" and ended up on his property. After awhile I would be pissed too.
You got to look at it like you owned it, what if it happens all the time an your just tired of it?

It's not a great feeling when people are playing in your backyard.


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